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MG MGB Technical - Fuel pump replacement options

Hello all,
My first post: I just acquired by first B. I am about to begin the ressurection after it suffered a run-in with one of the Midwest's finest tornados. The barn is gone, but the MG hung in there, cuddled up snuggly next to the Allis Chalmers tractor. On to the problem at hand. The stock fuel pump is dead. Hot and ground wires function and I've whacked on the pump till I feel badly about it. I removed the endcap and the points are not stuck. Still, there is not a single tick coming from the unit. Roger Williams, in his Auto-Doc book, reccommends forgoing SU pumps whether stock points & condensor or newer integrated circuit in favor of an aftermarket unit. Here's my question. What have you chaps used? Specifically, have any of you installed the "SU replacement" unit on page 115 of the Victoria British catalog (MG.53)? Do you know who makes it and if it fits the mounting bracket and fuel unions without (or with little) modification? Any problems?
Thanks, I mean Cheers!
Scott
S Gaither

the aftermarket ones buzz all the time...very annoying. To keep it short, with out a doubt, get an SU.
Paul Hanley

Scott - Paul is correct the pump you are looking at is what I term a "little, square, run all the time, make a lot of noise" pump. That said, it is a perfectly good pump that will serve very well for about 50,000 - 100,000 miles (but unless it is sound mounted, it will drive you crazy). Some people will suggest a Honda or a Subaru puump, both of which will be very good pumps that will last around 50,000 - 100,000 miles. Finall there are those who say that the only way to go is the SU all electronic pumps that look and sound like the original pumps but cost about 1/4 more and (at this point) have an unknown life expectancy, but I would bet that it is around 50,000 - 100,000 miles. I would suggest, if you are going to get a new pump, just get the standard points type SU pump at whatever discount price you can find and install it. We already know that the SU fuel pump is a perfectly pump that will last around 50,000 - 100,000 miles.

For a complete explanation of the SU fuel pumps, their history, the different models, how they work and how to troubleshoot them, see my article on them at:
http://www.custompistols.com/cars/articles/dd_su_fuel_pumps_101.htm
Oh yes, I can restore your existing pump and convert it to solid state, probably for less than what a new points style pump will cost. You can see a complete write up at the link given at the end of the above article.

Regardless of what you decide on the fuel pump, I would recommend that the fuel tank be checked for rusting. This is a common problem and the rust particles, if heavy enough can completely stuff up a fuel pump and stop it cold. If you find that your tank is full of rust, either replace it or have the original cleaned and sealed against future rusting
Good luck - Dave
David DuBois

Try a second hand subaru pump from a wrecker. I wrapped some foam around mine and jammed it into that odd "dead" space above the passenger foot well/front wing, so you couldn't see it. No bolts screws etc.., the tight location and the fuel lines held it firmly in place. I bypassed the SU pump with a bit of fuel line. All in all it took about half an hour to do and cost paracticaly zero. Also it ment pump and filters (one both before and after the pump) were easy to get at.
My pump came from an '82 wagon.
peter

Hate to see an SU pump go to pot.

Have you checked the pump coil for continuity?

Also try removing the valve body (scribe it's position orientation before doing this) and work the pump
diaphragm in & out manually. This may unfreeze
a stuck plunger.
Daniel Wong

Stick with an SU, and not the electronic type, I've junked mine after it let me down several times, and whacking those doesn't help either.

Did you measure 12v at the supply and ground terminals of the pump with the wires connected? If you measured 12v on the wires with a meter and they weren't connected you could still have a bad connection somewhere. Did you clean the pump contacts? Even new SU pumps come with a slip of paper saying the points should be cleaned if it doesn't work, they oxydise when unused for a long time.
Paul Hunt

For the record, I've had one of the electronic "cube" pumps installed on my 'B for the 5 years I'ver owned the car. It was installed by a previous owner. Yes, it runs constantly (with the ignition on), but as soon as the engine is running I certainly can't hear it. So, yes it hasn't got the traditional SU ticking, but I'm not in the habit of sitting listening to my pump. I get in, start the engine and drive.

Don't waste your hard earned money on an $80 version from Moss or VB. Get one at Advance Auto. Last time I looked, they were in the $30 range, made by Purolator. They come in 2 pressure ranges. Get the low pressure one.
Derek Nicholson

Howdy;
Been using The fuel pump from a 1985 Honda accord in all my customer cars for the last 14 years. Yet to have a problem I mount them on a B in front of the right tail lamp. GT on the metal in front of the spare area. Have one in my wife's GT for 78,000 miles with no problem. Very quite and reliable. Part #P70217 from O'Reillys $60.99. Same part # from Napa but higher price. I guarantee you won't be sorry. If you go SU you better carry a hammer and something to lay on on the side of the rode. Bob Thompson/International Auto
Bob Thompson

I have used the boxy Facet pumps in several cars for more than 20 years and I never experienced a failure. Yes, they are fairly loud but as soon as I start the engine they can't be heard over all the racket the engine and exhaust makes. I get mine from JC Whitneys and they're cheap and I always keep a spare and move it from one car to the other if I go on a long trip.
Mike MaGee

The pump Scott is referring to isn't the square Facet pump. I believe it is the same type that was on both my MG's when purchased. They should bolt in using the standard SU fittings. They are made of plastic and didn't last very pong. I think the 2 I had were made in Italy and were Quintin Hazel's. Advance Auto sells a cylinder type pump, it has the Facet tye circuit inside but after starting I cannot hear it run. Advance part# 5773407 Fuel Pump E8016S. About $30 three years ago.
FWIW, Clifton
Clifton Gordon

I use a Bendix pump which is almost 25 yrs old. Yes, I am courting disaster, but it is essentially the forbear of the Facet Cylindrical pump #1105 they show on page 38 of the Pegasus Racing Catalog, http://www.pegasusautoracing.com/pdfs/038.pdf . The two are identical, they have a built-in fuel filter on the tank side, and are quiet and, I guess, dependable.
Bob K Muenchausen

Hey,
Thanks one and all for the varied and informative replies. After absorbing all this I think I'll just drop the money and get a new stocker SU. I could cut corners, install a cheapie or fix only the part inside that failed and maybe save myself fifty bucks but, as soon as I have a failure, I'll blow same fifty on a tow and still have to fix or replace the pump. A direct replacement means less downtime (to repair the unit or to make a different one fit) and besides, the current unit lasted 32 years.
Thanks again for helping me make this decision.
Cheers,
Scott
S Gaither

Obviously, being an SU fan, I applaud your choice. Don't throw the old pump away though. It can be repaired and kept on hand as a spare (I have a spare permenantly installed in the car, with a switch so that it can be brought into use without even having to get out of the car). Good luck - Dave
David DuBois

I also use the Advance pump that Clifton describes. Defintely not original, but works like a charm. Easy to install. So cheap you can buy one as a spare.
Dan H.
Dan Hanson

With a Honda pump you don't need a spare. I'll still stop to help when I see you on the side of the road. Bob
Bob Thompson

Ditto Bob on the Honda pump. I mounted mine in the stock location on my '66. Quiet (sounds just like an SU) and reliable. Phooey on originality. When I'm dead the next owner can put an SU on if he/she wishes.
Cheers,
David
David

Bob - I had one of those on a Ford Courier that I had a number of years ago and it died at somewhere between 100,000 and 150,000 miles. All of them are electro-mechanical and will eventually die of ole age and wear. It was a good pump though. Cheers - Dave
David DuBois

I bought my aftermarket pump from JC Whitney for about half the cost of the same unit from Moss. It's not the square-noisy thing, but rather an electronic unit that fit right onto the SU mount. They sell them in various pressures, so make sure you order the right pressure pump for the carb(s) you've got fitted. It's been running for five years now, with never a problem. The manufacture also recommended using a filter between it and the gas tank, btw.
R. L Carleen

Dave,
Wow, you were so right! I pulled the tank and have never before seen so much sludge (the car sat in the barn 5-6 years). The combination of two gallons of fresh gas I had previously poured in (then seven out to drain it) smelled only vaguely of gas. Even after cranking only a short time I suspect I'll have to pull the new pump back off and clean out any sludge and/or brown liquid "varnish water" it may have sucked in. As for the tank, I think I'll give POR-15 a try with their clean / etch / seal process. (It will be a couple weeks before I have time to do it) Perhaps afterward a second fuel filter between the tank and the pump would add an extra measure of security against contamination. I want to fix the fuel system once then forget it.
Cheers,
Scott
S Gaither

I just changed my SU pump with another SU pump(the ticking comforts me). The old pump lasted 13 or so years, so reliability isn,t an issue. I'd keep an SU.
Dauntless

Every time you start a car with the SU you get a free diagnostic on the state of the needle valves in your carbs. If it doesnt stop ticking , they are letting through ( or you have a fuel leak) both need fixing .
S Best

Obviously I didn't have the luxury of having the fittings on my car anymore, so I had to make my new pump work on my car... pretty easy.
http://www.planetfurry.com/~skunkfox/pump1.jpg

http://www.planetfurry.com/~skunkfox/vixen.htm More pics here not much but enough.
CJD Dark

This thread was discussed between 11/04/2004 and 21/04/2004

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