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MG MGB Technical - Engine removal Questions

I am removing the engine from my 77 MGB. I am ready to undo the motor mounts. Where is the best place to attach the chain to the engine? and how? Should I attach the chain before the motor mounts are loosened? and get the hoist in place and get it to hold the weight? When should I remove the cross member? I have heard of putting a rolling jack under the trans to hold it up and keep it from hitting the ground is this okay? Any advice is appreciated. Is there any one thing that everyone forgets to remove to get the engine out?

Thanks, Tom
Tom

Tom: check out the "tilt Lift"[in the new Moss catalog] or one of the other items that do the same thing.It makes the job a lot easier. RIC
R E L Lloyd

Tom-
Pulling the engine out of the car need not be an exercise in fear. Get at least one friend to help out as it's not an easy job on your own. Although it may seem that the removal would be easier if the engine and transmission were separated while still in the car, the easiest way is to pull the engine and transmission as one unit with your engine hoist located directly in front of the car. It is possible to pull the engine separately, but there's a chance of damaging the first motion shaft of the transmission. In addition, putting the engine back in if the transmission is still in place can be maddening.
Remove the carburetors and intake manifold as a single unit, distributor, exhaust manifold, alternator, electric starter, heater valve, hot water pipe, and oil filter stand from the engine to lessen the weight to be moved about and to protect these items from being damaged. If your engine is equipped with antipollution equipment, it should also be removed prior to attempting to remove the engine from the car. Do not forget to remove the grounding strap. Removing both the radiator and radiator diaphragm will give more room in which to maneuver the engine/transmission package and decrease the angle to which the engine/transmission package must be tilted, making removal much easier. This will also avoid damaging the radiator. Raising the rear axle of the car up about 8 to 12 inches on jackstands will allow for the transmission to drop down lower and give you a better angle. Beg, borrow, or buy an Oberg Tilt Lift load leveler mechanism so that you can alter the angle of the engine as you lift it to allow maximum maneuverability in cramped quarters and make the extraction much, much easier. You might feel that it's an unnecessary luxury, but it's worth every cent not to scratch up your paint or dent and/or crease the sheetmetal inside the engine compartment.
Use the rocker arm studs for lift points only if you're certain that they're original as replacement studs nowadays are of dubious quality. Most failures will occur as a load is applied at an angle to an attachment point, so make those attachments strong, or, better yet, make them nonexistent by using a sling. Although some use a length of chain enclosed in a bicycle inner tube, I prefer to use a strap of heavy nylon webbing to lift the engine with. Not only is it strong and easy to undo knots from, but its greater surface area in contact with the block makes slippage less likely to occur and it's less likely to damage paint. Pass the strap between the engine and its backplate, cross it over above the rocker cover and loop it under the water pump, then tie the ends off with a simple square knot above the engine. With the hook placed behind the knot, it won't slip backwards, plus the square knot is self-tightening and won't slip either. Always remember the cardinal rule to never, ever put any part of your body anywhere below a suspended motor.
When you prepare to reinstall the engine, don't make the classic Beginner's Mistake of tightening down the front motor mounts and then trying to install the rear crossmember mount onto the end of the transmission package. Instead, before attempting to install the engine, attach the rear crossmember mount onto the transmission and leave its mounting bolts loose. With the motor hanging on the hoist it is much easier to get the transmission bolts started by hand. Tighten them using a half-height swiveling socket, with a 4 or 5 inch extension. With this tool, you can get to those rear bolts a lot easier.
Steve S.

Thanks for all the info. The engine is coming out tommorrow/ I believe I'm ready.

Tom
Tom

http://hem.passagen.se/larsragnar/
Page4
Ingemar

engine came out with no problems. it is pretty easy.

Tom
Tom

The only thing I do different than Steve is to use the tilt-lift bolted to the front and rear head studs-I quit using rocker studs when I read of someone one this BBS having one snap.
Ken Lessig

Threads like this are interesting. They sure show who does it for a living against those who do this work for themselves. I can't imagine why anyone would pull the gearbox unless IT needs to come out. One person in the rite mood can R&R the engine in a couple or three hours or less. Your likely gonna blow much of a day when you pull the gearbox. Bob/International auto
Bob Thompson

Anyone interested in how the transmission can be removed without removing the engine see this article in The North Carolina MG Car Club newsletter.
http://www.ncmgcc.org/Newsletter/0402/page5.html
Not sure if it was an overdrive or standard transmission. I first heard this from Eric Swanger about 5 years ago. FWIW, Clifton
Clifton Gordon

Bob, it takes me under two hours to pull the whole unit, by myself, on a gravel driveway. And I'm not bustin' a gut, either, I'm usually drinking coffee and smoking Winston Lights while doing it!! I did pull just the engine on a couple of cars, though. The first one went back in just fine. The second one didn't, it just didn't want to stab. It finally just shot right in, but I swore that was the last time I would ever pull the engine alone.
And as far as pulling the tranny by itself, I'd like to see it done with a 3-synchro OD.
Ken Lessig

Bob,

Find your comments very interesting. I have never taken an engine out, but will be over Easter. (It will be Easter as we get the Friday and Monday off in the UK, so it will give me 4 days to get the old out and the replacement back in and everything up and running for travelling to work on Tuesday). I have always found it hard to believe that it is easier to remove the gearbox as well as the engine, just to avoid the risk of bending the input shaft. Surely a bit of care, and a trolly jack to take the weight of the gearbox, and it will be easier just to lift the engine. Steve talk about taking the oil filter off to save weight, but leaves the gearbox attatched! (and I'm sure he has pulled a LOT more engines than me and knows what he is doing!!) How difficult is it really to realign the input shaft when returning just the engine? I plan just to pull the engine when I do it, unless I come accross compelling reasons not to. I have an engine sitting ready to go in, so it will literally be a straight swap.

Just my thoughts.
Iain
I D Cameron

Iain,

It is very difficult, at times to align the input shaft. Perhaps for the pros or others who have been lucky will tell you otherwise but it can be quite maddening trying to line up the gearbox and engine when they are both out!! (three syncro, small, fine spline input shaft) I would never, ever, ever think about doing them seperatly.
This topic is covered in umpteen threads--check the archives. The debate tend to run just like this one.

Paul
Paul Hanley

Whenever I pull the engine in my midget I leave the Gearbox in place. Apart from anything else it saves having to drain the oil out of it. Unlike the B the oil pours out at the rear of the gearbox when tilted. When I got my BGT I split the engine & gearbox the first time I had the engine out. It took me about four hours of frustration before I could get them to mate up again when refitting the engine. I know this was probably an extreme case and it was just as likely to slip into place first time, but since then the engine has come out with the gearbox attached which ensures no similar problems can occur.

Just my experience.

Cheers,

Dave.
Dave

Iain,

That's the way I have done this all my life and would never advise anyone to remove the gearbox as well for the very reasons you give. Alignment of the input shaft is straightforward given a little thought. I prefer to turn a steel mandrel that slides firmly through the inside diameter of the splines and also fits the pilot bush very snugly. This way there is no possibility of the disc being out of line or the mandrel being tilted. Plastic mandrels are a waste of time. Check this on your new engine whilst it sits on the ground. Provided that you keep a jack under the gearbox and continually keep the engine backplate parallel to the bellhousing all should be fine. It is easy to enter the pilot spigot into the splines as you can get your hands in at that point, then the engine crank nut can be turned as you push the engine back to engage the splines and if you are dead in line the gearbox may go fully home. If not, small adjustments of the jack to ensure parallelism will soon allow you to push the engine home.

Just one thought, both my MGs have a very blunt ended spigot shaft which does not help. Use an angle grinder with fairly fine disk to produce a 1/16"@45degree chamfer on it and it will enter easily.

Iain
Iain MacKintosh

I must admit I've never heard of bending the input shaft! The person must have heated it cherry red with a torch just before they slid the engine into place. Bob
Bob Thompson

Having the engine and gearbox on the floor in two hours is probably good time but I was talking about being done with a clutch job in two to three hours or less. Bob
Bob Thompson

I just pulled my first engine last weekend (engine and trans) and I'm doubtful that it makes much difference. The actual lifting/removing was pretty easy. Removing the rad, heater valve, oil cooler hoses, and manifold (with rotted studs)were a much bigger hassle than the actual lifting, and would have had to happen anyway. Frankly, I was amazed at how easily the whole thing came out.

As I see it, the trade off on the reinstall is whether you want to 1) spend time fiddling with the input shaft, or 2) spend time fiddling with the tranny mounts and driveshaft flange.

Steve

Steve Aichele

Yes but if you have to take the gearbox out for some reason then fit the mounts and crossmember to it on the garage floor and then throw the gearbox under the car and jack it up and into place. Far easier to fit the mounts this way than faff about underneath.

I see no reason to remove a transmission that does not need service.
Iain MacKIntosh

This thread was discussed between 14/02/2004 and 18/02/2004

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