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MG MGA - Anti Sway/Roll Bar - Addco

The BBS has been quiet of late so I thought I'd send a photo of the Addco sway bar (as recommended by Barney) that I fitted the other week to my 1961 Coupe. I had ordered it back in November last year and whilst it took ages to arrive (Addco seem to only manufacture them on order) I was very pleased with Summit Racing, their distributors. The sway bar was pretty simple to instal and I'm keen to try it out soon to see what sort of difference it makes. I found hardly any photos of this sway bar on my search of the internet prior to installation so hopefully this photo will prove helpful. I should add that since I took the photo I have slackened off the locknut as Addco Technical Support advised that the bushings should only just about be able to be rotated by hand.



Tim Prime

That through bolt seems very long. Do you have to trim it, or is there enough clearance to fit it the other way up?

How does the bracket attach to the A-arm?
Dave O'Neill 2

Dave. Its the bolt that came with the kit so I'm assuming its an okay length. There is a right angled bracket that is bolted to the arm with a bolt/locknut. Here is a photo of the kit pre-instal.


Tim Prime

Tim,
what size is your A/R bar?

Also, have ADCO recommended that you fit a set of clamps outboard of each of the rubber mounting bushes?

These clamp solidly onto the bar and just touching the rubber bush, they are designed to prevent sideways movement of the bar and this makes the outer end into a kind of extra stabiliser bar for the suspension.

I fitted them onto my 3/4" A/R bar but I wondered if anyone out there knows if they really made a difference?

Cheers
Colyn

PS: I got mine from Demon Tweeks but I can only find these similar ones online.

https://howeracing.com/index.php/store/suspension/sway-bar-clamps.html
Colyn Firth

In the UK at least these are often called end stops (kits) and available from the usual suppliers, I got my 11/16" 'Locator kit' from Sussex Classic Car Parts.

I was told by David Smith they should be fitted inboard, as per photo below.

Colyn,
originally I was told I didn't need end stops, for my road going only 70s midget, so didn't I didn't fit them but I could see on the bar clean patches where it had been moving in the clamp bracket bushes. My mate said I should fit them (IIRC on a road car?) so I did, outboard, then inboard. I can't remember now noticing any real difference when I fitted the end stops but I didn't do any testing or noting - or could just have forgotten now.

I've always thought replacing tyres (especially those with loads of tread left but are old and/or little use) is the best handling improvement (and is good for safety) to start with then, if not already fitted, followed by fitting a front ARB (anti roll bar / sway bar) which is also cost effective I think.



Nigel Atkins

With MGBs and Midgets, there seem to be many people selling uprated ARBs, but they never seem to supply, or even stock, clamps to fit the larger diameter bars.
Dave O'Neill 2

I've been running the under-slung front ARB on my MGA since 1988, and never had any end stops on it. The end links are short, so they have a stabilizing effect to keep the ARB centered (within reason).

When using original style ARB on top of the frame with longer end links, it is a good idea to install the end stops. They should be included in the ARB kit when you buy it.
barneymg

Nigel
I just had a quick look at my ARB installation and the "stop-ends" are actually installed inboard of the rubber bushes like yours.

Whilst I was under the car I checked the diameter of the bar as well, I thought I had an 0.75 inch bar but it actually measures 0.8 inches.

Looking at Tims Addco arb, the bend in the bar is quite a long way away from the mounting bracket and its rubber bush, when compared with our MGB under-slung bars, which like Barney says, tend to self locate.

So fitting "stop-ends" may be more beneficial on your Addco bar Tim.

Cheers
Colyn





Colyn Firth

Colyn, you troublemaker, measuring in decimal inches, I had to look at my chart, 8mm equals about 13/16", perhaps you have a 3/4" bar with very thick paint on it.

Presumably that's not a standard location for a horn(?) and would you have a Revotec fan by chance.
Nigel Atkins

Nigel

You are confused. 8mm?
Dave O'Neill 2

Nigel,
the ARB is definitely 0.8 inches thick or 20.32 mm, I suppose it could be a thick layer of paint but that would make the paint about 1mm thick.

I do run with two 8" Davies-Craig electric fans on the front of the rad and I have removed the engine driven fan. These work really well and they are well on top of keeping the 1950 cc engine cool.

I also have an oil cooler fitted underneath the radiator duct panel and I have cut a vent in the front of the Sebring valance to let air through to it.

Last year I fitted four anodised aluminium air intake ducts with flexible pipes which direct the air more directly to the oil cooler. Link attached
https://www.ebay.co.uk/i/163804946718?chn=ps&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=710-134428-41853-0&mkcid=2&itemid=163804946718&targetid=877040670379&device=c&mktype=pla&googleloc=2826&poi=&campaignid=9445848139&mkgroupid=95348628469&rlsatarget=pla-877040670379&abcId=1139126&merchantid=119084043&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIxJiHpYav6AIViLHtCh3CHQP9EAYYAiABEgLOq_D_BwE

This a picture of the vent and you may just see the ducts behind the grille.

The car came with just one horn like you saw on the picture and I fitted another one to get some sort of volume when I pushed the bottom. I know the original MGA horns are different but I think they are fitted pretty close to where mine are now.

Colyn

Apologies for the inverted pictures. I have edited each one numerous times, saving copies that were rotated 90 degrees to correct this, but no matter what I do, the images still appear inverted. Not sure why






Colyn Firth

How's this?





Dave O'Neill 2

Thanks for that Dave,
what did you use to edit the pictures?

Colyn
Colyn Firth

It took some effort.

I started with 'photos' in Windows 10. It seemed to work, but when I tried to upload them, they turned around again.

In the end, I opened them with MS Office 2010, rotated and saved, all good.
Dave O'Neill 2

Dave,
yes I got confused with 8mm instead of 0.8", I blame Colyn for using decimal inches, should use fractions or say same size as a silver 3d or florin coin so we all clearly understand in the land where we refer to furlongs and chains!

I too use Microsoft Office Picture Manager (2010) as I much prefer it. The Acrobat pdf still defeats me even when I turn to correct orientation and save it doesn't obey.


Nigel Atkins

Colyn,
I get the feeling you might have given up on concours originality. :)

But you're not using the car enough those horn connections, and the rest of the car, are far too clean and corrosion free. I would normally offer to put a few more miles on the clock for you, no charge, out of the goodness of my heart, but it'll have to wait for a while now.
Nigel Atkins

Nigel,
I have to admit that I did give that bit of the car a wipe over with an oily rag before I took the pic, so to be honest, that is the only part of the underside that isn't "road-film" grey in colour.

One advantage of having a fairly low riding MGA is that no one can see how dirty the wheel arches are.

If anyone ever mentions just how far my car is away from concours condition, I usually say that when I got the car it was a full race car, with full roll cage, race engine, no heater, a race seat and no interior trim.
So it is far nearer to concours today than it was then :^)

Cheers
Colyn

(Apologies for the metric inches, Nigel,I must have finally turned metric inside, for example, I seem to find it easier to understand 0.71 inches than 11/16th )
Colyn Firth

Folks - the Addco bar is 3/4". There were no stop ends included in the kit but I'll enquire with Addco on the need for these - they have a pretty responsive technical team. Glad to have stimulated a bit of discussion! Cheers. Tim
Tim Prime

Out of curiosity I went to have a look at my ARB which Bob West sold me about 20 years ago. I believe it was an MGB bit of kit that James altered the drop links to fit. As you can see it came with clamps.

Steve


Steve Gyles

And horn location. :)

Tim,
well done let us know how you get on.

Colyn,
you've given me a headache now, going not just decimal but metric too, all too much for me to take in!
Nigel Atkins

Tim, I think the weak point of that kit is the small angle piece to the A pan. I suspect that will fracture rapidly and render the whole thing useless. Barney may well have comments too.

I picked up an original roll bar for $5 and already had the chassis extension to mount it, with new drop arms and the spacer clamps. I bought new A pans and then found that I had been given undersize (and therefore dangerous to use parts - check Barney for details) but already had the reinforced pans anyway. It makes a big difference when driving around a hairpin bend - there are plenty of those around here!
Dominic Clancy

Addco have already responded. They say "In 99.9% of the applications the arm bends are close enough to the bushings to keep the bar from shifting.There are a few applications where they (stop ends) are required and with these we include them. I do not think they are necessary in this application but if you find the bar does start shifting I should have a set we could sell you."

I should perhaps comment that in my earlier photo of the uninstalled sway bar I haven't shown the rubber bushes at their actual spacing on the car. They are in fact much nearer the arm bend. I'll try and send another photo of the installed bushes. Tim
Tim Prime

On 23 March 2020, Dominic Clancy wrote:
"I think the weak point of that kit is the small angle piece to the A pan. I suspect that will fracture rapidly and render the whole thing useless. Barney may well have comments too".

On the contrary, that angle piece for attachment of the link to A-arm is quite substantial, 1/8-inch thick steel angle iron. Mine has been in service since 1988.

4/12/88 -- . 1,524 -- 3/4" Sway bar installed -- (161,433-mi)
5/11/01 -- 162,957 -- 7/8" Sway bar installed -- (304,675-mi)
3/23/20 -- 467,632 -- today -- (466,108-mi total on sway bars)

I have driven the crap out of this car, including weekend autocross and TSD rally all through the 90's, close to 25 race dates per year. Beginning 1994 I was running race tires and lifting a rear wheel in tight turns. Broke the 3/4" sway bar and installed the 7/8" bar in 2001. That kept the rear tire down when racing, but induces a bit of twitchiness and oversteer on street tires.

Bottom line is, 466,108 miles of abuse in 32 years, and those angle brackets are still hanging in there.
barneymg

Folks - here is a photo of the bushing so you can see that it is close to the bend. Tim


Tim Prime

Yes,your set up is pretty much like my arb Tim, I think it was your original picture showing the brackets nearer together that had me worried.

(I don't know why I first called them stop ends, sounds like something out of my plumbing toolkit!).

Before I fitted the clamps, the roll bar would sometimes make a creaking noise on the faster bends, the clamps stopped that.

You can soon fit them afterwards if you have any problems.

Barney, 466,000 miles, wow? Are you sure you have an MGA and not a London Taxi?

Cheers
Colyn
Colyn Firth

My MGA has 617,00 miles, but Someone else did the first 150K. Only 467K is on me, 214K in the last six years. They don't have to ever expire. Just keep up the maintenance, and keep on driving them.
barneymg

I have stops on my roadster and no stops on my coupe both with underslung bars. No idea whether stops are required!
But a thought, why note put a ring of masking tape around the bar abutting the bushes, drive the crap out of it (to quote a Barneyism) and see how much the bar actually moves laterally.
Mike
Mike Ellsmore

Good shout Mike. Will do. Tim
Tim Prime

Having enquired when this item was active I have just had an email from Moss to say their ARB is back in stock for £183. The price is good but are their any opinions on this item?

Paul
Paul Dean

Paul,
if you are buying a new anti roll bar, whether it is an MGB bar or the Addco type, go for a 3/4" diameter one.
The MGB 3/4" bar works brilliantly on my car, there is almost no body roll and the turn-in is still fantastic. I have not experienced any additional understeer in the wet either, in fact the grip in the wet seems almost as good as in the dry.

Although my first thought was to advise you to go for the MGB bar, Barney has done hundreds of thousands of miles using the Addco bar which is a testament in itself.

I fitted the strengthened front wishbones and I had to shorten the links when I installed the MGB 3/4" a/r bar but it looks like with the Addco bar, you can get away without re-enforcing the wishbone.

Cheers
Colyn
Colyn Firth

I checked with Moss and their bar is only 9/16 which I guess is really too thin? By the way I got an almost instant reply from Moss.

Paul
Paul Dean

This thread was discussed between 20/03/2020 and 18/04/2020

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