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MG Midget and Sprite Technical - dumb question... and a problem (Datsun 5speed )

Hi gang, I just installed my rivergate kit and datsun 5 speed in may, but i have aquestion... which i really should have figured out about 4 months ago:

what kind of oil was I supposed to put in it? when i bought all my supplies, i could swear i read something that recommended 140 grade gear oil, then after having done the conversion i read 90... At first i thought "oh well, my gears will jsut be extra oilly" but now i wonder if the thicker oil might be effecting my performance. The lower gears do feel more sluggish when cold. I hope this is not likely to cause any damage, but i don't see how it could!

Question 2, and this is the problem if i have to change the oil: I can't get the drain plug out! I didnt really worry about it when i put the trans. in because it would be ages before i needed to drain the oil (and I only noticed it was stuck after it was in the car). It's just stuck from having been in place for such a long time (the transmission waited 3 years between when i purchased it and when i installed it. IF it was a sump plug or such I would just get a bigger wrench and apply brute force, but i worry because it is an aluminum case and I worry about damaging it because it's a softer metal. suggestions?

thanks,
Chris
Chris Edwards

Grade 90 is recommended. Valvoline synthetic gearlube or redline.

If the drain plug isnt willing to part you can always pull the yoke and jack the front of the car. Makes a big mess and takes ages with 140 grade:-)
Bas Timmermans

As far as I can remember I'm using semi synthetic gearbox oil and never had to top it up.
Gary lazarus

dumb answer ...

Put the Datsun in more than ten (countem 10) years
ago and have never had to drain or refill. Prolly
should, but it just keeps on shifting amoothly.

Did not use synthetic. Pretty sure used 100.

But when you say that you cannot get the drain plug
out, can you elaborate?? Can't get the wrench in?
Can't turn the wrench?
chuckc

Chuck, I can't turn the wrench. It's stuck pretty solid, and i'm afraid to apply too much force incase i crack the case or something.
Chris Edwards

Id be tempted to use a 1/2 inch air or electric impact wrench, before I would a regular socket wrench...

I dont know how to explain it, but an impact wench has a differant kind of force then a wrench on a cheater bar....it tends to shock the metal and its loose before the threads have time to cry about it.

My electric impact wrench is one of my favorite power tools.

Here is what I used in my datsun 5 speed, it seemed to work really well.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000BCIHH0/ref=pd_lpo_k2_dp_sr_2?pf_rd_p=486539851&pf_rd_s=lpo-top-stripe-1&pf_rd_t=201&pf_rd_i=B0007ZFTOA&pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_r=18X6ACF7S7GSSWBMP2BC


Prop
Prop

Both mine have square heads. I put an adjustable wrench on them and use a medium blow with a hammer.
Trevor Jessie

thanks for the advice all, here's my plan: (to be executed whenever i need a break from taking things apart which I have been doing a lot lately)
I will spray some penetrating spray around the plug (although i doubt that will do much since it would have to wick into the join against the force of gravity, then do up an adjustable wrench (spanner) around the plug and give it a wack with a hammer (mediumish wack, thanks Trev!)

not much of a trouble really right now, since i have the fenders, bonnet, radiator, dash, wiring loom and a few other choice bits off for a "minor clean up" right now!
Chris Edwards

If the drain is on the bottom of the case, try SOAKING a rag with your penetrating fluid then stick the rag in a shallow container like a cut down tupperware bowl (Im sure the wifey will eventually forgive you) and use your floor jack to push the rag/container snug agianst the drain plug and let it sit over night.

I use PB Breaker with great success
Prop

good idea Prop... and there is no wifey so I do what I like... Until i run out of clean socks and then i do laundry.
Chris Edwards

LOL - do you double them first though?

When I read your question, I was quite interested in the responses, as the gearbox I'm now thinking to put in is a Datsun one, so, I asked the owner of it, who'd had one from Rivergate sent over, and he said he'd used synthetic oil and the change should be quite simple as the drain plug is at the bottom. In fact, he did point out that it's a whole load easier than my current one that I have to change regularly or it won't go backwards in reverse ...!

Good luck - and, whacking with a hammer always works :)
rachmacb

BTW - what's the phone number for Rivergate?
rachmacb

Rach, the number is 423-332-2030. Don't know about any additional numbers for international calling. Jack
Jack Orkin

Thanks Jack - now just pray for the Dollar to drop against the pound ;)!!!
rachmacb

Your in luck Rach,

The dollar is falling like lead feathers on a concrete bird with steel droppings ...

Currently the exchange is around USD/GBP $1.58

Meaning 1 GBP = 1.58 USD....so your getting about a 40% discount...An no taxes...shipping will be a bit rich

just on the kit your currently looking at about 540 GBP, plus extra for shipping, customs fees, and credit card exchange fee

Im guessing total currently... around 600 GBP...hope that helps

Unfortantly Im getting screwed as I would really love some barry king (UP-RATED) wish bones but it dosnt look like the exchange will ever go in my favor agian in my life time

I really wish Barry had a USA/Canada dist.


Being single is definatly the way to be...LOL

Prop
Prop

Hi Rach,

Don't get me wrong because I love my Rivergate/Datsun 5 speed set-up but if I was going to do it again, I would go with the ford box simply because the Datsun box is so rare these days. If anthing goes wrong (which is quite rare) then it the part usually has to come from the USA, where as with the ford set-up everything is here. When my front yoke of the propshaft got ruined I had the car off the road for nearly 3 weeks and if it hadn't hav been for a four hour round trip to borrow a propshaft from Jeremy Cogman in Hampshire, (and finishing the fitment of the replacement at midnight the night before my departure), I would have missed taking the Frogeye to Classic Le Mans.

Apart from which, I'm not certain that Rivergate make a kit for the 1500.
Gary lazarus

Here is the website... but for some reason its not working vary well

http://www.rivergate5speed.com/

Im pretty sure the datsun wont fit the 1500 only the 1275

You make a great point, its hard to get parts for the datsun even here in the USA, besides I think the ford 9 is a better trans, certianly stronger

Prop

Thanks, yes, there is a problem with their website, hence why I called them ... ;)

You're right, they don't do it for a 1500, which is a tad strange, as one of the datsun boxes fits almost exactly - and would get rid of all the adaptions needed for a stupid ford one, which then has the gearstick coming out at a stupid angle in a stupid place, which is only suitable for "touring"

Plus, it might be stronger, but it is also over 15kgs heavier :P! I might as well just add another steel girdered rubber bumper to the side of the car .......!!!!!!!!!!
rachmacb

Rach,

talk to Deb, there is a 5 speed (4 with an electric over drive) that fits on a triumph...which I dont remember which car, but deb knows all the specs and what is needed.

I dont think its a Big issue for the conversion, and I think the stick is in the right place, about the same weight as a ribby 4

Update... I found a small website...its a triumph spitfire trans (I didnt say tranny just for you), it does have a differant gear change hole, and you have to cut the tunnel for the added 5 gear.

Hope this helps, also there is more info in (dare i say it) the Arcives (EEEEEKKKKkkkkkkk), there is a great write up on this from john mangles in st louis missouri as he did one for a customer, turned out nice

I would have the box completely rebuilt 1st before install as I doulbt they are much better then a ribby as to longeivty

Prop

http://www.gerull.nl/mg/technics/engine/5speed.html
Prop

danial stapelton has a nice write up in his book power tunning the midget on the spitfire trans (or tranny) .

you can do a partial read if you do a google search with his book and spitfire Trans (tranny for thos that dont know what a trans is) conversion
Prop

LOL - I only wanted to call them to ask if they had a ready-made propshaft - rather than getting one built, at, for interest, the place that Deb told me about!!!

Yes, you can fit the over-drive onto a Midget box, as it was standard in the equivalent Triumph, but it too involves alot of fiddling and widening what you call the transmission tunnel (I think!)

Imagination knows no-bounds - and the Toyota gearbox is way way way better than the ford one I think - but, since I can go way up to and over the legal speedlimit - I do wonder what's the point .......
rachmacb

I was re-thinking your datsun box today, to be honest it is a good little box, you dont hear about it falling apart vary often, And I have been surprised at how fast delivery is from one side to the other. sometimes its comes faster then I can mail a letter across the street so getting parts (Delivered) isnt an issue as it is finding neissian dealers wanting to help you with the parts, now thats the trick. my neissian dealer has been good to work with, so let me Know.

I think you would be fine with the rivergate set up, after all you got the datsun box already, so your 1/2 way home,

For me I was shocked at the huge gas mileage improvement but the power is nice also

acouple of notes... Id get there slave clutch instead of there rig job, and Id get the high torque starter so you dont have to cut a hole in the trans and dealwith dirt getting into old lucas starter, and dont forget the speedo angle converter.

I really think this is something you can do on your own...after all It only took me like 4 weeks to install...LOL


Prop
Prop

As far as I remember the Toyota boxes were that good they used to use them on V8 conversions on the MGB so a standard Spridget use would be bullet proof (?)

Overdrive for me was good in an MGBGT but not so good in a Triumph GT6 (2000) - 5th gear I think is better
Nigel Atkins

Indeed - the only one I've ever heard of having a problem was one fitted to a midget that was doing well in excess of 25 000 miles per year - and, even I don't do that many!!!!

IF I go ahead with any conversion, then, it will NOT take me 4 weeks to install :)!!! Even allowing for "gossip time" that will incur as I don't have my own engine hoist, and both of the males I know who do talk way too much ...!
rachmacb

Rach, as a woman you surly must know of the female skills to make a man to shut up?

LOL!!!!!
Arie de Best

In all truth rach you can do it in a couple weekends...if your well organised and nothing else gets in your way in the line of extra work to be done with the engine out, Id say a good solid long days of a weekend and it can be done,


Warning this joke is X-rated....








Why do men love getting BJs?



Because its the only time a man can spend with his woman and have peace and quite
Prop

LMAO - THAT would be the problem - other than gossip ...! But, there I was thinking it was a whole load of other reasons ... ;)

Prop, I AM well-organised - just ask Arie :)!
rachmacb

This thread was discussed between 30/09/2010 and 06/10/2010

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